This issue has been the talk of blogs for 6 months or more and could have been easily rectified long ago to avoid the Constitutional crisis we are now facing and will soon come to a head. The simple remedy would have been for Obama to produce his birth certificate, if legit this would have gone away. He hasn’t, he chose to file for dismissal instead, he went to Hawaii and had the governor lock any birth records up, Why? What is he hiding?
More and more proof has come out that Obama was not born in Hawaii, proof that his mother was not in the country when he was supposedly born. The statement of the grandmother saying she was at the hospital in Kenya when he was born, conflicting statements from O and his sister on which hospital in Hawaii he was born. Simple proof of a birth certificate would end all speculation and not the phony one already posted on the internet.
So where do we go from here? How will this work out in the near future? If he proves this by Dec. 1st it’s over and we move on. But, if Dec 1st comes and goes Obama ignores the SCOTUS the next step is the Electoral College.
SCOTUS could TOTALLY IGNORE the issue and refuse to hear the case, citing lack of standing, but I think that they won’t. If they ignore this, then they might as well throw the Constitution out the window. It wouldn’t be worth the paper its written on. Anyone could then thumb their nose at the Constitution. I think they have to hear the case and demand the birth certificate.
Assuming Obama is found ineligible:
1. If BEFORE the Electoral College meets, McCain’s electors from all States would be seated (since Obama would not have been qualified) and the vote would be 538-0 (Article II, Section 1, Paragraph 3). This would happen because Obama would not have been qualified to run in the first place. Biden would be VP since the 12th Amendment provides for the separate election of POTUS and the VP. Biden would be eligible and his electors would elect him. Thus, a McCain/Biden term.
2. If AFTER the Electoral College meets and certifies him, but BEFORE inauguration, the 20th Amendment provides that, if before the time fixed for the beginning of his term, the President-Elect shall have failed to qualify, then the Vice President-Elect shall act as President until a President shall have qualified. The same scenario as in (2), above, would then likely apply.
3. If AFTER inauguration, the 25th Amendment would apply and Biden would be President and choose his VP (with Senate confirmation). However, McCain might be able to sue – based on fraud and demand that the scenario provided in (2), above, be applied. Or, barring that, a new election.
4. Of course, SCOTUS could decide to avoid (1), (2), and (3), above, by declaring a fraudulent election and ordering a new one with verified eligible candidates. This would necessitate the implementation of Continuity Of Government laws – allowing Bush to remain POTUS until the election. Probably with the caveat that no new laws be passed in the interim.
I fear for this country and what we are about to witness. God Bless America and be prepared.
Berg said he was told by a clerk for Souter that his application for an injunction to stay the election was denied. But he also said the defendants “are required to respond to the Writ of Certiorari” by Dec. 1.
Will Supreme Court have say in presidency?
U.S. Supreme Court Justice David Souter has rejected an emergency appeal for the court to halt the tabulation of the 2008 presidential election results until Democratic presidential nominee Barack Obama documents his eligibility to run for the office, according to an attorney who brought the action that challenges the Illinois senator’s standing in the race.
However, the issue isn’t going away, at least for now, since Souter set a schedule for a response from Obama to the challenge from attorney Philip J. Berg.
As WND reported, Berg brought his claims to the Supreme Court after a federal judge dismissed his lawsuit alleging Obama is ineligible to be president because he possibly was born in Kenya.
The judge concluded Berg lacks standing to bring the action.
The 34-page memorandum that accompanied the court order from Judge R. Barclay Surrick said ordinary citizens can’t sue to ensure that a presidential candidate actually meets the constitutional requirements of the office.
Instead, Surrick said Congress could determine “that citizens, voters, or party members should police the Constitution’s eligibility requirements for the Presidency,” but that it would take new laws to grant individual citizens that ability.
“Until that time,” Surrick says, “voters do not have standing to bring the sort of challenge that Plaintiff attempts to bring.”
In a statement today, Berg said he was told by a clerk for Souter that his application for an injunction to stay the election was denied. But he also said the defendants “are required to respond to the Writ of Certiorari” by Dec. 1.
Tags: obama, Patriot post
This is just getting silly.
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2008/jun/27/obamas-birth-certificate-part-ii/
You seriously believe this man is not qualified to be President? Even though multiple objective media outlets have debunked this nonsense? If you don’t like his policies, I can dig it. If you want to spend the next 4-8 years investing yourself in wingnuttery like this, well, I can’t say I agree. The counter-arguments to the veracity of his birth certificate are rumor and conspiracy laden innuendo.
Does anybody reasonable person really accept Obama as being “qualified?” 143 days as a state senator before running for the US presidency doesn’t generally qualify one to manage a McDonald’s, much less the presidency.
I’m just a law and order kind of person. Why would a judge rule that a former Pennsylvania Attorney General didn’t have “standing” to file a suit simply to see the actual certificate? Why go through so many hoops just to avoid producing the actual certificate? Why doesn’t he or you care to abide by our laws, and the prerequisites for the presidency? If it exists, why in God’s Name didn’t he produce it (the actual one) before he ran?
Okay, first off, you’ve made a regular reader out of me. You are just too funny. You really believe that Obama has managed to forge a birth certificate? And that the State of Hawaii is a co-conspirator?
But anyway, even in your fantasy world, you’re wrong about scenario number one. The Obama electors would be seated– unless the State Legislatures decide otherwise. There may be State laws that don’t allow electors for an unqualified candidate, but there’s nothing in Article II that would force the States to automatically swap their electors out for the guy who came in second. Forget it. Scenario one would actually have the same result as number 2. And if the electors for Obama get thrown out, then no candidate will have a majority and the House will determine who is President. I don’t think they would pick McCain.
Go take your meds and make this McCain/Biden thing you have going disappear from your brain.
I would think a runoff election, or a two-round system would be in order if Obama is found to be ineligible, whereby two eligible candidates from the first round, i.e. the primary — presumably Hillary & McCain — would run, as opposed to declaring McCain the winner as 2nd runner-up.
Re: “proof that his mother was not in the country when he was supposedly born.”
What is the proof please? Do not repeat the grandmother claim. It is not clear that she understood the question.
But if you have proof that Obama’s mother was not in the USA, that is evidence. What have you got, a passport? A document from the immigration department of some other country – such as Kenya?
If so, please show it.
If you don’t have documentary evidence, please be honest enough to admit it.
“Why go through so many hoops just to avoid producing the actual certificate?”
Because the actual certificate has already been provided. It was provided to the AP and other media organizations for examination. It was provided to the State of Illinois when Obama applied for his legal license, drivers license and marriage certificate.
So, if you feel sufficient proof of the location of his birth has not been provided to you, I suggest you take it up with two of the United States, the US Senate, the Illinois Bar Association because clearly, they are all in on this “conspiracy”.
Also, if I was a Presidential candidate, I’d tell whacko wingnuts to eat a pile of shit and wouldn’t capitulate to every demand made by people who are clearly more interested in an agenda or personal gain. The proper authorities have his documentation, case closed. This is just like the bullshit we listened to during the Clinton years about Vince Foster, Ron Brown and his several out of wedlock black children in Arkansas. It’s tedious.
Re: “Why go through so many hoops just to avoid producing the actual certificate?
And let me add that Obama has not gone through any hoops. The only ones who are asking to see a “real” birth certificate are right-wing bloggers.
If anyone other than right wing bloggers, such as a court or election commission asked to see the birth certificate, Obama would have produced it. Why not? It is there.
So what are you raving about? He is not going through hoops. He published a perfectly valid certification of live birth, which is proof and is adequate. No one, other than bloggers, have asked to see anything else. Why should he publish anything else? Certainly not to make bloggers happy.
IF there were valid documentary evidence that Obama was born outside the USA, all this would change, and Obama would have to show all the evidence he has. But until then/
By the way Berg’s allegation that the Supreme Court has asked to see Obama’s real birth certificate is likely to be wrong. The Supreme Court is not a judge of facts. It never has been. It does not ask to see evidence. In this case, the issue is not Obama’s birthplace. It is whether Berg has standing to sue. In the unlikely event that the SC finds that Berg has standing to sue, all they would do is send it to a lower court for a finding of the facts, and unless there is evidence that Obama was born outside of the USA, it is highly unlikely the lower court would find for Berg.
So, my advice is “don’t worry, be happy” because you’ll feel so bad if the Supreme Court does not rule the way that you want or a lower court consider it, or a lower court rule the way that you want. Give it up. Relax. Go with the flow.
What? Just sit back and be happy people are violating the constitution? 11 states have filed suit, plus the PA AG, not just bloggers — and we’re wingnuts? We can always tell who has the diseased liberal mindset — those that reduce their arguments to namecalling, not facts.
strauss, you contradict yourself, unless I misunderstand. First you say “If so, please show it (proper documentation). If you don’t have documentary evidence, please be honest enough to admit it.”
Then you say “He published a perfectly valid certification of live birth, which is proof and is adequate.
Which is it?
11 States have filed suit? WOW, which crazy ass website did you read that off of?
Yeppers,
Its a waste of time trying to reason with the unreasonable. You could have video of Obama’s mother giving birth to him on the steps of the Lincoln monument and these wack-jobs would still find something to bitch about…
Re:strauss, you contradict yourself, unless I misunderstand. First you say “If so, please show it (proper documentation). If you don’t have documentary evidence, please be honest enough to admit it.”
Then you say “He published a perfectly valid certification of live birth, which is proof and is adequate.
It is adequate until there is evidence to the contrary. So far there is no evidence to the contrary.
If you have evidence, please show it.
What? Just sit back and be happy people are violating the constitution? 11 states have filed suit, plus the PA AG, not just bloggers.
Yes, but it is only bloggers who are asking him to post something other than his certification of real birth.
The logic of the cases is that IF they are allowed to come to trial, then Obama may be forced to show is birth certificate. Or maybe not. Even if the cases come to trial, the certification of real birth may be good enough to serve as evidence in court – absent there being proof that he was born somewhere else.
So, only in the case of the law suits being allowed to go ahead, and only if the court(s) ask for something other than the certification of real birth, has anyone asked for something other than the certification of real birth.
The Supreme Court certainly has NOT. That’s all from Berg. The SC is not a court that hears evidence. If it allows the Berg case to go to trial, then it would send it to a lower court to hear the evidence.
So, let’s get back to the current situation. Right now, only bloggers have asked for Obama to post anything more than his certification of real birth. Why should he do it?
To make bloggers happy?
Some keep saying “there is a constitutional issue.” Well, no, there is no constitutional issue unless there is proof that Obama was born outside the USA.
Some years ago there was a religious cult that forecast that the world was going to come to an end, and they worked out the date, and it came and they all went to a park to see the end, and it didn’t. Imagine how disappointed they were the next day.
For your sake, I hope you can deal with the highly likely event that the Supreme Court does not hear Berg’s case or any other one related to Obama. Or, in the very unlikely event that the SC does allow cases to go forward, lower courts will find for Obama.
Why? Because there is no evidence that Obama was born in Kenya.
(It’s also very unlikely. Have you considered what it cost to fly from Hawaii to Kenya and return in those days in TODAY’S DOLLARS?)
You’re kidding, right? They’re asking him to provide proof he was born in the U.S., absent an
authentic one, embossed stamp and all. You’re saying he doesn’t need to provide proof, except that he was born in Kenya. !! To do so would be slightly opposed to his agenda, and next to impossible, considering the record-keeping capacity of a third-world country, most of whose population doesn’t even wear shoes.
hey counselor, you think showing that a kenya birth certificate doesn’t exist is proof he’s a u.s. citizen? think it’ll hold up in court?
You are retards. John McCain was born in Panama, but he is a citizen because his mother was a citizen. Obama’s mother is a citizen. He could have been born on the moon and he would be a citizen because his mother is a citizen.
Why isnt there outrage because John McCain is really a Panamanian? I’m gonna go out on a limb here and say its because he is white.
Actually, at the time of McCain’s birth the Panama Canal Zone (in which he was born) was considered part of the United States and therefore he is a natural born citizen. His parents could have been Panamanian and it would not matter.